But we have to cheat for Krishna.

Because there was no breakfast, Prabhupada talked with the temple managers for quite a long time. He is quite frustrated with Akshayananda Swami's style of management. Although Akshayananda is undoubtedly sincere, he seems to not have any realization about what is to be done or not done, nor how to do what Prabhupada tells him has to be done. Even when he says he understands, things don't get done. A case in point is the alterations to the guest house lobby. The banging, thumpings and wall-breaking continue ceaselessly. Prabhupada complained about it again and Akshayananda said that it was being done under someone else's direction while he was out of station, and that he did not want the work to be done. Thus when he promised Prabhupada that the work would be finished soon, Prabhupada skeptically remarked, "And how long this work will continue? Throughout the whole life?" "No. I'm going to finish it today," Akshayananda Maharaja promised. Prabhupada was exasperated. "You say no, but it is going on. You simply say no, yes, no, very good. That's all." Prabhupada complained that his disciples are "very expert at manufacturing nonsense ideas." I asked him how we can distinguish a good idea from a bad one. "You have to take ideas from your guru," Prabhupada replied. "Therefore gurum evabhigacchet. Why do you manufacture yourself? Consult the authority, then do it. That is intelligence. Why do you think that you are very intelligent? That is materialism. The more you remain that 'I am a fool,' that is good. And as soon as you become over-intelligent, then, that's finished. So Europeans, Americans, they are over-intelligent. They have intelligence, over-intelligence. Unnecessarily they manufacture a machine for shaving." He imitated the sound of an electric shaver, making us all laugh. "Gnowgnowgnow gnowgnow. And they have wasted so much time, so much time. But people like it." Then Srila Prabhupada got down to practical business. Akshayananda, repeating Prabhupada's comment from yesterday that the devotees do not even require soap, wondered how they would wash their clothes. Prabhupada told him that soap was required, but because they were "spending without any sense" he had said no soap. Then he revealed some other radical cut-backs he and Bhagatji decided on last night. He said that only twelve or thirteen rupees should be spent on flowers. Right now they spend fifty, and still get cheated with decaying flowers. Akshayananda said that it was difficult to avoid being cheated, and that even Bhagatji sometimes gets cheated. Prabhupada accepted that it was a difficult thing to stop. "Cheating is one of the qualifications of the conditioned soul. Vipralipsa-bhrama, pramada, vipralipsa, karunatmika. So cheating is a qualification of the conditioned soul. Everyone is expert in cheating more or less. That is qualification. People take pride, 'Oh, I have cheated. I am so expert that I have cheated.' When the lawyers make some agreement between the two lawyers, simply think, 'How I can cheat you? How can I cheat you?' That's all. The more one lawyer is expert in cheating, he is big lawyer." Akshayananda had a rather idealistic notion of how to avoid being cheated. "So that means if we become pure then we can avoid being cheated, because we ourselves will not cheat any more." Prabhupada though, was much more practical and realistic. "No, this world is full of cheaters. We have to live with them. Sate sattvam samacaret. You also have to become better cheater, that is wanted. Otherwise, you cannot exist." Akshayananda nodded. "But we have to cheat for Krishna." "Do everything for Krishna, " Prabhupada replied. "That is all right. But this world, if you become simple, and the whole world is full of cheaters, then you suffer. Therefore you have to know and protect yourself from the cheaters. So sometimes we have to become a bigger cheater. This is the world. Vancaka-vanci, whole world is going on, my Guru Maharaja used to say, that one is cheater, another is cheated." Prabhupada went on to mention that anyone who is serious about advancing in Krishna consciousness is welcome to stay with us. "We don't make any discrimination. Abalavriddha-vanita. Bala means children. Vriddha means old man, and vanita means woman. They are most helpless. Beginning from the child up to the old man. But coming here, if they plan for sense gratification, that is very dangerous. Come here, stay with us. We shall somehow or other provide him with prasada and place?but be advanced. And the simple method is recommended." He quoted the verse from this morning's class: "Yasyam vai sruyamanayam krishne parama-purushe bhaktir utpadyate pumsah soka-moha-bhayapaha. Very simple. Simply hear Bhagavatam. And actually if anyone seriously reads Bhagavatam, he'll become saintly, no doubt about it." "Your Bhagavata," Akshayananda said. "There are no others actually." But Prabhupada was modest. "Vyasadeva, the words of Vyasadeva. I am simply trying to explain, that's all." "No one else is trying. No one else has done it," Akshayananda added. But Prabhupada still refused to take any credit. "It is due to the blessing of my Guru Maharaja. He directly told me that 'If you get some money, publish some books.' I took it seriously, so he's helping me. All our Godbrothers, they didn't take it. Did not know it, neither ... Even they ... They know it, because from the very beginning, Guru Maharaja was serious about publication. He started press and published these books." Pointing to the large Bengali volume lying on his desk he went on, "This Bhagavata was published by him. And the journal, six journals, he was very much fond of publishing, publication. Very, very. He told me directly that if it was possible to get the marbles from this Gaudiya Math and sell it and convert it into books, 'I would have done it. Because I know there will be blazing fire in this place.' And by Krishna's grace, by selling books we are getting. This is Krishna's grace." Akshayananda brought the discussion back to the budget. "So 5,000 you have estimated for the Deities for a month?" Prabhupada shook his head. "Five hundred." Akshayananda and Gopala Krishna were a little stunned. "Five hundred?" Right now they are spending up to 9,000 rupees a month. Prabhupada explained how he had arrived at the figure. Although there are ten main Deities on the three altars?Gaura-Nitai, Prabhupada and Bhaktisiddhanta; Krishna and Balarama; and Radha-Syamasundara, Lalita and Visakha?he is cutting the number of plates offered to the Deities from ten to six. On each plate eight puris are offered. Bhagatji calculated the cost of the flour and ghee used to make 48 puris to be two rupees. In this way, they calculated the total cost of the entire offerings to be about 500 rupees. Prabhupada said that it was a rough calculation, and in case they had missed something, he agreed to allow the total expenditure to go up to 1,000 rupees, but no more than that. Dutiful as ever, Akshayananda Maharaja assured Prabhupada that he would go over every item with Bhagatji. "You don't believe me?" Prabhupada asked him. Akshayananda knitted his brow. "I can't understand. My intelligence is not great enough to understand it. I believe you, but I have to do it. That's all." "It cannot go more than 1,000," Srila Prabhupada emphasized. Akshayananda nodded. "I can't quite grasp it, Prabhupada. But you say it can't go above 500, so that'll be it." "So I am speaking of the Deity, not for all," Prabhupada told him. "For all others, 100 rupees per head, 5,000 rupees. Here puri, kacuris, and other things, all the best things. But general is not for puri, kacuri, and, ... they are general food. We are not going to supply puri, kacuri, halava to everyone?only for the Deity. Everything calculated." Akshayananda wanted to assure Prabhupada that he was going to get right on top of it. "I believe you, Prabhupada. But to make it practical I want to see every item. The cost, the weight, and everything." But to Prabhupada his affirmation of responsibility was another symptom of his dyslectic management style. "It is already calculated," Prabhupada told him. "Then I can do it. Then we can do it," Akshayananda said, eager to please and say the right thing. Prabhupada simply repeated, "It is already calculated. I calculated not with a fool, with an experienced man." Gopala Krishna raised a practical point about Yasodanandana Swami's party of about ten men who are planning to stay here on a month's break before heading north for more preaching. He wanted to know how to deal with that, because with the new budget it was going to strain temple resources to support them. While sympathetic to their desire to have a short hiatus in their travels, Prabhupada said that they should go out and preach and bring in some collection. He said they may stay for one week. "One month is too much. That is laziness." As this talk went on, an Indian grihastha, Isvaracandra dasa, arrived. He has been living in Mathura for the last couple of years with his wife and children, trying to establish some business, but so far he has been unsuccessful. Prabhupada interrupted his management meeting to speak with him. He spoke frankly, as a sadhu, or "one who cuts", asking why the man did not join with the preaching work. "You are trying in your own way. But Krishna does not like that program. You can manufacture your something, idea, but Krishna will allow or not. I tell you, this is practical. You are a qualified man, foreign-educated man, and you have come back for the last one and a half years. Still you are in nothing. It is surprising. That means Krishna does not want you to do that something. You take it from me. These boys have come because they found, outside Krishna consciousness, life is nothing. That's a fact. Therefore they are sticking to this. They knew it very well. That outside Krishna consciousness the whole world was vacant, 'Nothing for us.' That is a fact. Therefore they have got something here. They are not foolish rascals, they're sticking for nothing; there is something. It's a fact. So for nothing, 'Oh, we have suffered.' And come to something. If you want." He quoted a verse to the effect that one has to see the material world as having no value. "If anyone wants to go to Bhagavan then he has to make this material world voluntarily nothing, nishkincanasya. Nishkincana means nothing. Kincana means something, and nih means not?then nothing. So one who has made this material world as nothing. How it is made? Brahma-bhutah prasannatma. Because with this something, as soon as one will stick to this something, he'll suffer. Sada samudvigna-dhiyam asad-grahat. Because he has accepted this rascal situation, asat. Asat means either temporary or bad. Asat, temporary or useless. So this material world is ... temporary we can know it is. But it is useless, that we do not know. Therefore we struggle. 'Let me go, let me fight, fight, fight, fight.' That is maya." He used two striking examples to illustrate how maya induces us to chase after illusory goals. "A man is sitting on the ass. And his hand just on the front of the gadha, ass, he's putting some grass. And the gadha is thinking, 'I will eat this grass,' he's going forward. But the grass is also going forward. This is very instructive. The grass is, say one feet, above his head. And the man is sitting on his back. But because this gadha does not know that 'Actually this man is sitting on my ... As soon as I go forward, the grass also goes forward.' But because he's ass, he does not know. He thinks that 'If I go a little forward I'll get the grass.'" His other example was that of an animal chasing a mirage. As the animal moves forward, so the mirage also moves. "So this material world is like that. Ask anybody, any so-called successful. Unless he's an ass, nobody will say that this is very comfortable. So best thing is to become nishkincana. Nishkincanasya bhagavata-bhajana. This is Caitanya Mahaprabhu's instruction. Bhagavata-bhajana means nishkincana. You make nothing this material world. That is real Krishna consciousness. And so long I'll make this material world something, then I'll suffer." As an example of nishkincana he cited the story of Draupadi. "Draupadi, when she was grabbed in the assembly and Duryodhana and Karna wanted to make her naked. So generally woman, if you try to make her naked, she'll try to save herself. So she was trying to save herself and when she thought, 'There is no way. My husbands are here. They are not helping.' She was trying to help herself. But when she found that it is not possible, then she did not try to save the cloth. She said, 'Krishna, save me!' Two arms. You have seen the picture. And then Krishna supplied cloth. So it is, 'Go on, yes, Duhsasana, you go on. You try to make her naked. I'll supply. So this is Caitanya Mahaprabhu's instruction, that if one is serious about bhagavata-bhajana, he should take it, whole material world, as nothing. Then Prabhupada spoke from his own experience. "Sometimes I think, I made nothing this material world, and again retired in Vrindavana. Again Krishna, you have given so many things. What is the purpose? At that time, I remember Rupa Gosvami's instruction: 'This is not mine. This is Krishna's.' Nirbandhah krishna-sambandhe yuktam vairagya. We are exerting so much energy to construct a temple, but as soon as we become implicated, 'Now I have got this big building. Let me live very comfortably.' Then it is very dangerous. So long we work for Krishna, it is Krishna's, I am still nothing. And as soon as I take it, 'Oh, now I have got very good, comfortable place. Make me again something.' Take that as dangerous. Otherwise, there is no danger. Therefore we have to be engaged always in Krishna's service. Not that because we have got this nice building and income also, let us now sit down and eat. Then you'll stop. You shall have to be engaged always. Because our brain is materialistic, as soon as there is little chance of utilizing for sense gratification, mind [says] 'Yes, yes. Do it.' Still, we have to do it. Prapancikataya buddhya hari-sambandhi-vastunah mumukshubhih parityagah phalgu vairagyam kathyate. Rupa Gosvami. Hari-sambandhi-vastunah. Things which are connected to Krishna, you should never think it that it is material. It is spiritual." He then asked Isvaracandra what his ambition was. "There must be something, why you are sticking to that company. There must be some ambition." For a long moment Isvaracandra said nothing. He seemed to have no real reason. Finally, he said that he wanted to take care of his family. Prabhupada continued to pierce through his consciousness. "So how you can take care with nothing? Krishna makes you nothing, then how you can take care of your family? These things I have explained. That we have got so many means against struggle for existence, but that is not final. Tavat tanu-bhritam tvad-upekshitanam. If there is no sanction from Krishna, you cannot do it; it is impossible. If Krishna does not like you to be implicated in that way, that is false, then how can you do it? You are thinking that I shall take care of my family. But if Krishna wants that you cannot take care of your family then how you'll do it? Can you go against the will of Krishna? You can understand at least this, if not very much advanced. You cannot go against the will of Krishna. So you have tried for the last one and a half years, you could not improve your material situation. That means you are going against the will of Krishna. Take it from me." He asked Isvaracandra how many children he had. When he said that he had four, Prabhupada added further weight to his argument. "Everything is discussed in the Srimad-Bhagavatam. Kripana, brahmana, kripana tripyanti neha. He knows that one bacca [baby] has given me so much trouble. Illicit or legal, it is troublesome business. Otherwise why these Americans and Europeans, they're killing their own child? They don't want to take the botheration. So it is botheration, there is no doubt about it. The Bhdgavata says tripyanti neha kripanah. What is the meaning of kripana? Do you know? Miser. Miser, what is the meaning of miser? Yes. We have got this something, human form of body, to develop Krishna consciousness. Instead of doing that, in spite of possessing this something, I am utilizing it for sense gratification. If you want sense gratification, that's all right. Get one child, two child. Why again and again? Therefore sastra says tripyanti neha kripanah. Because he's kripana, he's never satisfied. He's suffering?again, another child, again, another child. All right, you have got two child, one child, that's all right. Be satisfied. Why again and again? The kripana, he does not know how to utilize this asset of human life. He's wasting the asset in a different way. One has to become brahmana. The opposite word of kripana is brahmana. Brahma-bhutah prasannatma. That is wanted. So we are giving brahmana's position. Instead of taking the brahmana position, if he wants to take again kripana position, then what is the use of being initiated? All these great sages, saintly person, who were they? They were all brahmanas. Sukadeva Gosvami is always addressed, 'Brahmana.' Is it not? This is brahmana's business; it is not the kripana's business. Kripana's business means he does not know how to utilize the asset." Prabhupada looked at his disciple compassionately. With a soft voice he spoke straightforwardly but with no softening of the reality. "So it is my duty to speak the truth. So now you can do whatever you like. Give him prasada." Isvaracandra continued to listen attentively as Prabhupada continued to dwell on the business of family life. "Of course, it is very difficult, this itching. We have got practical experience. When there is some itching, we cannot stop it. We cannot stop it. Even if I do not want it, still. So it is like itching, nothing more. Kanduyanena karayor iva duhkha-duhkham. The tapasya means how to control this itching sensation. This is tapasya. Tapasya means brahmacari. Tapasa brahmacaryena samena damena, tyagena, satya-saucabhyam yamena niyamena. This is tapasya. It is very strong power, this. Therefore Bhagavata said that this power, sex power, is there in the hogs. They have no discrimination between mother, sister, daughter. And simply busy. The example is given. This capacity is there in the hog. Are you hog? How example is given. Do you like to remain like a hog? One should be saintly, yes. Then where is the difference, 'I'm a human being, I am treating like hog?' Therefore this very example. Nayam deho deha-bhajam nriloke kashtan kaman arhate vid-bhujam This is for the hogs. This hog civilization is going on as human civilization, that is the difficulty. Whole world is hogs and dogs. Big, big United Nations, and what are the assembly? Hogs and dogs. The politicians, as soon as he gets some time for relax, immediately he becomes hogs. Go to the hotel, prostitute, and drink and dance. Is it not?" Prabhupada laughed at the idea. "All politicians, you become a big hog. That's all. Without becoming politician, a small hog. Because they have got political-big hog. So how you can expect prosperity from these big hogs? After all he's hog. What benefit you can derive from this assembly of hogs, United Nations? United hogs. You cannot expect. He's hog." Referring to the Indian government's program of enforced sterilization being imposed on the general population, Prabhupada said, "Now they're making propaganda for sterilization. And if we advise make a brahmacari-asrama from the beginning, they will not take. 'What is this nonsense, brahmacari?'" Akshayananda wondered why they reject the idea. "Is it because they cannot do it?" Prabhupada said they can do it if they want. 'Just like by training you have given up so many things. You were accustomed to this illicit sex and meat-eating, but you have given up. But why? By training. So if we request the government, 'Let us open this brahmacari ...' They'll not help. But they'll make the other propaganda; they'll make contraceptive method. And naturally one Hindu widow is trained up not to marry again. Once she got a husband, that's all right. Now you convert your, you divert your attention to Krishna. They'll make propaganda. 'Why stop her sense gratification? Let her marry again, widow marriage.' Why widow marriage? If there is voluntarily giving up begetting any more child, to avoid husband, why the widow marriage bill is introduced? "Everything was natural, brahmacari. The sterilization is already there. That will not be accepted. Widow, she's remaining refrained from. Just like we have now asked our girls not to dress attractively, widow. They should dress not attractively. Because after all, what is this sex enjoyment? It is not very good thing. By outward attraction they attract. Nice sari, nice face powder?one becomes attracted. Therefore this is psychology, that if the woman does not dress very nicely, she will not be attractive. Unnecessarily attraction she will avoid. But a woman is naturally, her psychology is dress very nicely so that man may be attracted, because they want shelter. This is the whole psychology. They, although they declare independence, they cannot live independently, that is not possible. Therefore they are by nature accustomed to dress attractively so that one may accept her and give her shelter. This is psychology. Otherwise, why the woman are naturally inclined to dress herself nice? Man does not. This is the psychology. A boy, sixteen-years-old boy, he does not, he is roughly dressed. But a sixteen-year-old girl will never remain roughly. She'll always try to decorate herself very nicely and utilize her youthful beauty for attracting. Why attracting? Because she wants shelter. Therefore it is the duty of the father and mother that she is young girl, she wants shelter, and out of passion, lusty desires, her selection may be wrong. So before she selects out of her own way, 'Let me, it is my duty, I am guardian. Give her some good shelter.' This is Hindu process." Akshayananda said that although it was perfectly natural, "They will say restricting, unnatural." "They may say," Prabhupada said. "But this is natural psychology. Father, mother, they know, the well-wisher of the children. Now everything is spoiled. But we don't care for this. We say take to Krishna consciousness, everything will be adjusted." We continued discussing the sterilization program and Akshayananda asked if when they perform the operation, it spoils their intelligence. "Because as I have read, if the semina can go to the brain, then there can be some intelligence, if even a little could go. Is it by sterilization no more can go to the brain? So they have become oxen. They've become like the oxen." Prabhupada nodded. "Nowadays boys are dull. Why dull?" "So dull in India," Akshayananda said. "Everywhere," Prabhupada observed. "Because they discharge semina like anything. Must be dull. There is a word, uddhareta. Reta means semina. One who has learned how to divert the movement of the semina to the brain, uddhareta, greatest yogis. By yogic power they can do that, instead of discharging, going down." Akshayananda, formerly a married man with two children who has been a sannyasi since 1972, lamented the unfortunate position of the victims. "So if they become sterilized then there's no more possibility for the semina to go up. Never again. Nothing can go to the brain. Therefore their brain is finished for life." Srila Prabhupada wasn't entirely blaming the government however. Recently reports have come in that all the babajis in the greater Vrindavana district, including Govardhana and Radha-kunda, have been taken by the busload and sterilized. just like this babaji has been sterilized, because the government knows, even the so-called sadhus and babajis, they are using their sex. It is open secret. Because so many women go to hospitals, American hospitals. The hospital men, they do not take it serious, 'It is natural, a man and woman.' But it is strictly forbidden according to spiritual life." Akshayananda said that he knew a doctor, one of our life members, who was now required by the government to perform a certain number of sterilizations per day or else he does not get paid. According to the newspapers, in just one state 70,000 women and 36,000 men have been forcibly operated on. And the law is that if a couple has three children, they must be sterilized. Akshayananda Maharaja commented that this is a real sign of Kali-yuga's progression. "A woman is in charge and she is castrating all the men-making them brainless like the oxen." He felt that because of this situation, our preaching in India must be very tactful. But Prabhupada saw it all as an opportunity to increase our preaching. "No, just like I was speaking from Bhagavatam. If you speak only on the subject matter as it is mentioned in the books, it is already tactful." Quoting this morning's verse again he said, "Now they are in a position of soka-moha-bhaya. So you take to Krishna consciousness. This is the best best tact, now it is the time, now they are put into soka-moha-bhaya. It is already there going on, soka-moha-bhaya. But it is now special time for soka-moha-bhaya. So you have to take it. It may be out of fear, bhaya, they may take to Krishna consciousness." He explained that among the pious, those who are distressed turn to God. And even if someone is not very pious, if they hear the chanting of Hare Krishna, they will become sukritina. Akshayananda made the claim that practically every one of our devotees had contemplated suicide before coming to Krishna consciousness. He admitted that at least he had. Prabhupada agreed that suicide was a common thing. He recalled seeing high buildings and towers in the West with protective barriers around them just to prevent people from throwing themselves off. He said that there was a technical name for when a person kills himself by leaping off a mountain. "This is easier than other type of suicide. Because you simply once jump. But as soon as you fall, you forget everything. Suicide itself is very bad." The talk of suicide sparked an inquiry from Akshayananda about a Mayavadi contemporary of M. K. Gandhi, Vinoda Bhave. "This Vinoda, fasting until death, until cow slaughter is stopped. So if he dies, then he is guilty of murder. Is it correct? And if he's a brahmana, he is guilty of brahma-hatya. So by this fasting he is committing a greater sin than the actual killing of the cows." "You are right," Prabhupada said. "And what he'll get it? Does he think that by his dying of starvation this cow-killing will be stopped? That is his foolishness." Prabhupada said that the man had no sense of what he was doing. Akshayananda complimented Srila Prabhupada that only he has described things plainly in the Gita. "No one else has done that. Cinmayananda's, this, that rascal, no one has. No one has explained that. They don't know." Prabhupada chuckled. "No, anyone who is not in our disciplic succession, he's not a human being. Cinmayananda, Vivekananda, this-ananda, they simply ... Ananda, there is no ananda. All nir-ananda." Prabhupada laughed again, saying he had heard of one of our life members, a prominent man in Bombay, who made a telling comment. "He is very intelligent. He has said to a friend that Bhaktivedanta Swami-sata mukala. Means that he has made all other so-called sannyasis, yogis, blackfaced." Prabhupada mentioned the names of a couple of local spiritual leaders, including one of his godbrothers, and asked matter-of-factly what had they achieved. "I am not proud, but what have they done in comparison to me? Everyone should be ashamed. They may be envious on account of their failure, but if you come to the actual valuation, sata mukala. That's a fact. "In Bengal it is said if a brahmana is black, he is dangerous. That means he's not pure brahmana; brahmana cannot be black. Just like a European, if he becomes black, that means he has mixture. European and American, if he's black, that means mixture. So brahmana family, it must be very fair, sukla. Brahmana, kshatriya family must be very beautiful, if he's pure." He quoted the Bengali saying again. "It is a slang language, kala brahmana. Brahmana should not be black, and sudra should not be white. And a Musselman should not be dwarf" because formerly real Musselmen were coming from Kabul, Afghanistan. If a Muslim is dwarf, that means he is not real. Prostitute's son, and poshya-putra, adopted son. They are all of the same class. "Adopted son, he gets money without any earning and spends. I have seen so many adopted sons. Generally adopted son means spoiled son, because he gets money. One who has got money but no children, he takes some adopted son. So the adopted son thinks that 'I have got so much money,' and he has never worked, he is spoiled. I have seen many adopted son. Got lakhs and lakhs of rupees, and in one night he's spoiled everything. Simply after woman and wine. I have seen it. There was one gentleman, Narendranath Singh. Very big, palatial building and very rich man. I have seen him when he was finished. He was friend of big, big person. And one day I saw in Calcutta, there was raining and he was sitting in a rickshaw, and no friend. He had known practically all big men of Calcutta, friend. Nobody is coming, 'Well, Narendra, you are sitting. Come on in my car.' Nobody. And he was drenching, there was heavy rain. And when he was rich man he was keeping Rolls Royce car." With that Prabhupada brought the meeting to a close. It had been a management meeting, but he had utilized every opportunity to preach. Without philosophy, there is no management.